808labs

Touchpad Palm Detection – the “confidence” feature

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by

Barton George
in

More info from the tech team:

The XPS 13 9343 utilizes the Microsoft Precision Touchpad specification in I2C mode. The specific feature within the Microsoft Precision Touchpad specification is the “Confidence” feature:

Confidence

Confidence is used to indicate that the contact does not have any dimensions (height or width) > 25mm that implies that it is not an unintended contact. Windows Precision Touchpads should not reject any contacts in firmware processing, but should forward all contacts to the host and indicate the confidence. After a device has deemed a contact to be unintentional, it shall clear the confidence bit for that contact report and all subsequent reports. Until a contact has been deemed unintentional, the device shall set the confidence bit for that contact being reported.

With that feature correctly implemented, palm rejection in I2C mode should work.

Driver feature development is something we work with our vendors on ensuring they develop, though in this case they won’t since the Microsoft Precision Touchpad specification is a feature that falls outside of vendor-specific needs. Synaptics (or any other touchpad vendor) is unlikely to implement this feature in the Linux i2c_hid driver because it’s not vendor-specific but instead a Microsoft specification.

Microsoft Precision Touchpad specification:

https://msdn.microsoft.com/en-us/library/windows/hardware/dn467314%28v=vs.85%29.aspx

HTH

Pau for now…

Comments

42 responses to “Touchpad Palm Detection – the “confidence” feature”

  1. nobodyatwp Avatar
    nobodyatwp

    So, that means “broken” for Linux [or any other non M$ OS] and probably forever, unless an open source driver is created!

    🙁

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      Hi @nobodyatwp

      It’s not broken, it’s just that unfortunately no one in the community has added that functionality to the driver yet. Just like anything else if it is important enough to enough people someone will tackle it.

      HTH

      Reply
      1. Richard Avatar
        Richard

        Since it was Dell choosing this particular hardware for a machine they said they promised they would support it would be good if they hold up their promise and contribute to the open source community in this way.

  2. Marc Avatar
    Marc

    About time Dell released a full linux compatible device, with its own specs & own design. Stop trying to install linux on a Microsoft spec’ed machine. XPS Dev Edition is sold out in Europe, so there IS a market for it!

    Reply
    1. Tom Avatar
      Tom

      +1

      Reply
    2. Richard Avatar
      Richard

      +2

      Reply
  3. W Avatar
    W

    Offtopic, but will the new XPS 15 have a developer edition?

    Reply
  4. David Avatar
    David

    Are Developer Editions for the new XPS 13 and XPS 15 planned? Matte Full-HD and SSD please. Also, I’m particularly interested in a Linux-compatible notebook + dock solution (the new Thunderbolt dock looks interesting).

    Reply
  5. sojusnik Avatar
    sojusnik

    An ETA for the developer edition of the new XPS 13 for Europe, especially Austria, would be awesome!

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      I cant give specific dates but we are working on it now with Canonical. Stay tuned.

      Reply
      1. Tommy Avatar
        Tommy

        We will 🙂
        Thanks for the effort!

      2. mambro Avatar
        mambro

        Will it have intel wifi?

  6. dundalk Avatar
    dundalk

    Will this new version of the XPS 13 have different hardware to the current release (in the US) or is it just the Ubuntu software that is changing? I would rather wait if the new hardware will be better/more Linux friendly. I ask because I actually work for (ahem) another Linux vendor and will wipe the Ubuntu install anyway.

    Reply
  7. thibault Avatar
    thibault

    Hi Barton,

    When are you going to implement the sputnik and cloud launcher tools please? How much improvement did you made on those? Will it be release on the next sputnik revision?

    Thanks
    Thibault

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      Hi Thibault,

      Until further notice the cloud launcher tools are on permanent hold.

      thanks

      Reply
  8. thibault Avatar
    thibault

    thanks a lot Barton for your answer can you then tell me more about the improvement made on the profile tool? when will it implemented?

    Thanks
    Thibault

    Reply
  9. Mark W Avatar
    Mark W

    Hi Barton, do you now if the new XPS 13/15 Developer Edition will have an Intel Wifi card? I think it would be a great idea because it has more compatibility and is more linux-friendly.

    Reply
    1. Richard Avatar
      Richard

      I replaced the Broadcom myself. It’s now in a drawer being worthless, but at least not disrupting my system.

      Reply
    2. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      Hi Mark,

      Thats the plan 🙂

      Reply
      1. Blanca Avatar
        Blanca

        Awesome! Can’t wait! 🙂

      2. sojusnik Avatar
        sojusnik

        Is it probable, that the new XPS 13, as a developer edition, will be released still this year?

      3. Barton George Avatar
        Barton George

        @sojusnik it will probably be a bit later

      4. idonthavetobuyamacbook Avatar
        idonthavetobuyamacbook

        @Barton George
        definitely not this year? oh, what a pitty…. 🙁

      5. Barton George Avatar
        Barton George

        Believe me we arent happy about this either but we want to make sure we deliver a great customer experience

      6. ofciwontbuyamacbook Avatar
        ofciwontbuyamacbook

        Hey Barton, of course i totally appreciate your efforts! I am having my eyes on the DE of the XPS 13 for some months (unfortunately, when I was able to pay for it the developer edition was sold out in Europe). I am a computer science student and in desperate need for a nice subnotebook…and I am a 100% sure that the DE is gonna make me really happy, when it’s finally out. 🙂

        So, I will probably go and get a cheap Chromebook for the time being and buy the DE as soon as it gets available in Europe.

        Cheers and thanks a lot for Project Sputnik.

      7. Barton George Avatar
        Barton George

        @ofciwontbuyamacbook,

        thanks for the support!! 🙂

  10. Jyrinx Avatar
    Jyrinx

    Hi – Would you happen to know what’s going on with the low-end Sputnik laptops like this one?

    https://www.starryhope.com/dell-inspiron-14-ubuntu-edition/

    The link to Dell still works, but it says “Call for pricing” in lieu of a Buy button. I called and the guy mentioned the XPS, Latitude, and Precision lines with Ubuntu, but nothing under $1000. Have they really already discontinued the Ubuntu Inspiron line since June?

    Reply
  11. Sam Avatar
    Sam

    Hi Barton, do you know if the RAM in the next DE of XPS13 will still be limited by 8 GB? That’s not a lot for the “developer” machine in 2016.

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      We will have 16GB as well 🙂

      Reply
  12. tannerjfco Avatar
    tannerjfco

    If better driver support is not in the immediate future, can we at least have a reliable way for the touchpad to disable when typing? The size of the machine makes it impossible to not have at least some contact with the touchpad when typing, and I haven’t been able to remedy this on my own.

    Reply
  13. Etienne Avatar
    Etienne

    I just got my new XPS 13 and installed Ubuntu on it. Works pretty fine except that I find power management a bit flaky (seems the cpu doesn’t always scale down after having scaled up) and palm detection not working.

    Now I read there’s a dev edition coming up. Should I return my XPS 13 or is it better to keep it because the hardware will not fundamentally be different?

    Reply
  14. XPSgroupie Avatar
    XPSgroupie

    Hello Barton, I wish you a happy new year! Can you provide us with some new informations regarding the future specs and maybe even a vague release date of the XPS 13 DE?

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      happy new year to you!

      We are nailing down the configs for the new XPS 13 DE that should be out very soon. The configs will be based on the Windows version. Stay tuned!

      Reply
      1. XPSgroupie Avatar
        XPSgroupie

        Thanks a lot for your quick response. Just checked the dell website for XPS13 configs – this means no non-touch 16GB RAM version? Too bad, but nevermind I’ll probably take a 8 GB version.

      2. Davide Avatar
        Davide

        Barton, is there any reason why Dell enforces useless and counterproductive high-dpi, glossy, touch displays for the most powerful versions? I’m a data scientist and a software developer, I need a fast, powerful machine with a Full HD matte display, but all I can get is an underpowered machine with the right screen, or good specs with an useless, counterproductive, overpriced glossy screen.

      3. Ewan (@the_ewan) Avatar
        Ewan (@the_ewan)

        Sounds exciting; any word on whether the TB15 dock is likely to be Linux friendly?

      4. mambro Avatar
        mambro

        I’ve been speaking with Dell chat and I’ve been said that the program has been continued and that the Developer Edition will not be available for this generation of xps13. Is that correct?

        If it is not, do you have any indications on when it will be available? Is it a matter of a month or it is more like 3-6 months? Also will there be any hardware difference with the windows version?

      5. Barton George Avatar
        Barton George

        @mambro, the new version will debut closer to a month rather than 3-6 mos.

  15. Marc Avatar
    Marc

    Any news regarding a 15″ DE? Was hoping to see the Precision 5510 as a possible candidate, which has the same form factor as the XPS 15.

    Reply
    1. Barton George Avatar
      Barton George

      Marc,
      We are working on the 5510 as we speak, stay tuned 🙂
      thanks!

      Reply
  16. Daniel AJ Avatar
    Daniel AJ

    Is there any progress on this? I’m still significantly limited in the use of my XPS13 9343. I can’t use it any place I don’t have space for an external mouse (airplane, train, my lap, etc.) because, to make it usable, I have to turn off the touchpad. With the touchpad active it can’t type. The cursor jumps around like crazy, random text gets marked and overwritten, etc. This is very bad.

    Reply
    1. radicsge Avatar
      radicsge

      you can use “syndaemon -i 1 -K -d” to disable touchpad while typing as a temporary solution. (Also by enabling palm detection with xinput at least disables the text selection, even if doesnt really detect palms)

      Reply

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